Hi all,
I think is good idea to make the UI more clean and modern.
For this we need to port the images in the toolbar to symbol icons.
Also, in GNOME 3.10 the Stock items is drop [1], and UI with Stock is look outdated.
I attachad a patch and screenshot (with GTK+ 3.11.0, from git).
I missing some symbols: Choose a color, Build, Search & Replace, Compile, Save All, Reverte, Close All and Quit icons.
For Stock Icons I missing many places, but I started to work on this (it just search and replace).
[1] https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gtk-devel-list/2013-July/msg00000.html
Regards, Yosef Or Boczko
Le 11/10/2013 01:24, Yosef Or Boczko a écrit :
Hi all,
Hi. I won't be much available this WE so I'm dropping a quick reply.
I think is good idea to make the UI more clean and modern.
For this we need to port the images in the toolbar to symbol icons.
Why would it be more "clean" and "modern"? OK, GTK guys seem to think that having a non-uniform desktop experience by dropping one of the greatest features GTK had (stock items) is a good idea, so we probably will have to do something at some point, but I highly doubt it will make anything "cleaner".
BTW, IIUC (I didn't read all of all the threads) even them realize that breaking apps look with the same major toolkit version like they did for 3.10 wasn't a good idea.
Also, in GNOME 3.10 the Stock items is drop [1], and UI with Stock is look outdated.
How does the UI look outdated? Using named icons won't change a thing, in the end they all use the theme's icons.
I attachad a patch and screenshot (with GTK+ 3.11.0, from git).
I missing some symbols: Choose a color, Build, Search & Replace, Compile, Save All, Reverte, Close All and Quit icons.
It's weird for Quit icon, and probably revert and search, but Build, Compiler, Save all, etc. are custom things so unless the theme provides some it will always look different, no matter what API you use. And the other items also use stock icons, and they use your theme.
<ot>(and BTW dropping stock items will most likely make weird icons more and more common)</ot>
For Stock Icons I missing many places, but I started to work on this (it just search and replace).
I don't like it, at least like you did it, because it drops a lot of icons (like in buttons). And I like icons on elements, it makes common things like Cancel or OK a lot easier to recognize at first glance.
I'm not saying that we should keep using stock items or something, but AFAIK there currently isn't much non-deprecated API that exists both in GTK2 and GTK3 that allows for icons (and even better, allows for icons at the user's choice -- I can't get why having or not icons can break a UI design, but I guess I'll never understand UI designer's POV apart that they love removing useful stuff because they think users a so duuuumb).
</gtk rant>
So well, if there is a way not to use deprecated API while not changing the UI I'd be fine with it; but otherwise you'll need to have a way better argument than "moderner" to convince me :)
Cheers, Colomban
On Fri, Oct 11, 2013 at 2:43 AM, Colomban Wendling lists.ban@herbesfolles.org wrote:
Le 11/10/2013 01:24, Yosef Or Boczko a écrit :
Hi all,
Hi. I won't be much available this WE so I'm dropping a quick reply.
I think is good idea to make the UI more clean and modern.
For this we need to port the images in the toolbar to symbol icons.
Why would it be more "clean" and "modern"? OK, GTK guys seem to think that having a non-uniform desktop experience by dropping one of the greatest features GTK had (stock items) is a good idea, so we probably will have to do something at some point, but I highly doubt it will make anything "cleaner".
BTW, IIUC (I didn't read all of all the threads) even them realize that breaking apps look with the same major toolkit version like they did for 3.10 wasn't a good idea.
The icons in Stock is icons in some sizes, not SVG. The symbolic icons is SVG, better polished. Note: also for the symbolic icons have a themes.
Also, in GNOME 3.10 the Stock items is drop [1], and UI with Stock is look outdated.
How does the UI look outdated? Using named icons won't change a thing, in the end they all use the theme's icons.
The icons in the menus and in the buttons in the dialogs isn't add any information. I not think the 'OK' icon is add information there isn't in the string „Save”.
I attachad a patch and screenshot (with GTK+ 3.11.0, from git).
I missing some symbols: Choose a color, Build, Search & Replace, Compile, Save All, Reverte, Close All and Quit icons.
It's weird for Quit icon, and probably revert and search, but Build, Compiler, Save all, etc. are custom things so unless the theme provides some it will always look different, no matter what API you use. And the other items also use stock icons, and they use your theme.
About the custom icons: same to add a GEANY_STOCK_SAVE_ALL icon, I want to add a symbolic icon for Save All.
<ot>(and BTW dropping stock items will most likely make weird icons more and more common)</ot>
For Stock Icons I missing many places, but I started to work on this (it just search and replace).
I don't like it, at least like you did it, because it drops a lot of icons (like in buttons). And I like icons on elements, it makes common things like Cancel or OK a lot easier to recognize at first glance.
As I sad: „The icons in the menus and in the buttons in the dialogs isn't add any information. I not think the 'OK' icon is add information there isn't in the string „Save”.”
I'm not saying that we should keep using stock items or something, but AFAIK there currently isn't much non-deprecated API that exists both in GTK2 and GTK3 that allows for icons (and even better, allows for icons at the user's choice -- I can't get why having or not icons can break a UI design, but I guess I'll never understand UI designer's POV apart that they love removing useful stuff because they think users a so duuuumb).
GTK+ 2.24.0 released in 2011, soon we are in 2014.
Also the widgets with image in a menu is deprecated (GtkImageMenuItem, for example), and also the function to create a buttons with Stock item is deprecated (gtk_button_new_from_stock() and gtk_image_new_from_stock() for example).
</gtk rant>
So well, if there is a way not to use deprecated API while not changing the UI I'd be fine with it; but otherwise you'll need to have a way better argument than "moderner" to convince me :)
Cheers, Colomban _______________________________________________ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.geany.org https://lists.geany.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devel
On 13-10-10 05:14 PM, Yosef Or Boczko wrote:
On Fri, Oct 11, 2013 at 2:43 AM, Colomban Wendling lists.ban@herbesfolles.org wrote:
Le 11/10/2013 01:24, Yosef Or Boczko a écrit :
[snip]
Also, in GNOME 3.10 the Stock items is drop [1], and UI with Stock is look outdated.
How does the UI look outdated? Using named icons won't change a thing, in the end they all use the theme's icons.
The icons in the menus and in the buttons in the dialogs isn't add any information. I not think the 'OK' icon is add information there isn't in the string „Save”.
So why have anything that doesn't add information? We could use text-only toolbar, force off user's theme choice and use plain/stock theme, remove choice of syntax highlighting colours, remove icons from the symbols tree, hard-code the font family and size to the Geany developers preference, etc...
In reality it doesn't matter what we think, or what the GNOME design team thinks, such stuff is extremely subjective and personal and the only apps that need to care about GNOME design manifesto are GNOME applications themselves.
P.S. As you can tell this subject is extremely controversial outside of GNOME-land (or at least inside of Geany-land), please don't mistake rants for anything personal against your own valid opinions :)
Cheers, Matthew Brush
On Fri, Oct 11, 2013 at 3:27 AM, Matthew Brush mbrush@codebrainz.ca wrote:
On 13-10-10 05:14 PM, Yosef Or Boczko wrote:
On Fri, Oct 11, 2013 at 2:43 AM, Colomban Wendling lists.ban@herbesfolles.org wrote:
Le 11/10/2013 01:24, Yosef Or Boczko a écrit :
[snip]
Also, in GNOME 3.10 the Stock items is drop [1], and UI with Stock is look outdated.
How does the UI look outdated? Using named icons won't change a thing, in the end they all use the theme's icons.
The icons in the menus and in the buttons in the dialogs isn't add any information. I not think the 'OK' icon is add information there isn't in the string „Save”.
So why have anything that doesn't add information? We could use text-only toolbar, force off user's theme choice and use plain/stock theme, remove choice of syntax highlighting colours, remove icons from the symbols tree, hard-code the font family and size to the Geany developers preference, etc...
In reality it doesn't matter what we think, or what the GNOME design team thinks, such stuff is extremely subjective and personal and the only apps that need to care about GNOME design manifesto are GNOME applications themselves.
It not right, you not adds things without any reason. In the toolbar there isn't place to text, so use icons with a tooltip instead. In button in dialog have a place to text, so not need a icon and a tooltip. Syntax Highlighting colours is for **highlighting** the code, and the icons in the symbols tree is for distinguish between kinds of symbols (yes, is not matter what is the icons in the symbols tree, it just need to be different), etc - for each thing in the UI have any reason!
P.S. As you can tell this subject is extremely controversial outside of GNOME-land (or at least inside of Geany-land), please don't mistake rants for anything personal against your own valid opinions :)
Before GNOME 3.10 I was used the icons in the buttons and in the menus, but I see is realy ugly and not useful.
Cheers, Matthew Brush
Devel mailing list Devel@lists.geany.org https://lists.geany.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devel
[...]
In reality it doesn't matter what we think, or what the GNOME design team thinks, such stuff is extremely subjective and personal and the only apps that need to care about GNOME design manifesto are GNOME applications themselves.
It not right, you not adds things without any reason. In the toolbar there isn't place to text, so use icons with a tooltip instead.
There is no reason that you can't have bigger toolbar buttons to fit text as well. A new user shouldn't have to search tooltips to find what they want.
In button in dialog have a place to text, so not need a icon and a tooltip.
Consistent icons across the UI including dialogs and menus allow choice by glance without reading the text. Tooltips should *explain* the action of the item, if it just repeats the text, ... patches are welcome :-)
Syntax Highlighting colours is for **highlighting** the code, and the icons in the symbols tree is for distinguish between kinds of symbols (yes, is not matter what is the icons in the symbols tree, it just need to be different), etc - for each thing in the UI have any reason!
And there are reasons for things outside your use-cases.
P.S. As you can tell this subject is extremely controversial outside of GNOME-land (or at least inside of Geany-land), please don't mistake rants for anything personal against your own valid opinions :)
Before GNOME 3.10 I was used the icons in the buttons and in the menus, but I see is realy ugly and not useful.
As Matthew said, UI design is often a personal choice based on the users particular needs. You may see things as ugly, and not useful in your use-case, but another may see it as essential. Merely repeating your personal preference as fact does not make it so.
Cheers Lex
Cheers, Matthew Brush
Devel mailing list Devel@lists.geany.org https://lists.geany.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devel
Devel mailing list Devel@lists.geany.org https://lists.geany.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devel
On 13-10-10 05:47 PM, Yosef Or Boczko wrote:
On Fri, Oct 11, 2013 at 3:27 AM, Matthew Brush mbrush@codebrainz.ca wrote:
On 13-10-10 05:14 PM, Yosef Or Boczko wrote:
On Fri, Oct 11, 2013 at 2:43 AM, Colomban Wendling lists.ban@herbesfolles.org wrote:
Le 11/10/2013 01:24, Yosef Or Boczko a écrit :
[snip]
Also, in GNOME 3.10 the Stock items is drop [1], and UI with Stock is look outdated.
How does the UI look outdated? Using named icons won't change a thing, in the end they all use the theme's icons.
The icons in the menus and in the buttons in the dialogs isn't add any information. I not think the 'OK' icon is add information there isn't in the string „Save”.
So why have anything that doesn't add information? We could use text-only toolbar, force off user's theme choice and use plain/stock theme, remove choice of syntax highlighting colours, remove icons from the symbols tree, hard-code the font family and size to the Geany developers preference, etc...
In reality it doesn't matter what we think, or what the GNOME design team thinks, such stuff is extremely subjective and personal and the only apps that need to care about GNOME design manifesto are GNOME applications themselves.
It not right, you not adds things without any reason. In the toolbar there isn't place to text, so use icons with a tooltip instead. In button in dialog have a place to text, so not need a icon and a tooltip. Syntax Highlighting colours is for **highlighting** the code, and the icons in the symbols tree is for distinguish between kinds of symbols (yes, is not matter what is the icons in the symbols tree, it just need to be different), etc - for each thing in the UI have any reason!
As a real-life analogy since I'm quite bored right now...
I'm not sure how they are in all different parts of the world but I assume it's similar everywhere, traffic lights have at least 3 different round lamps in them, one is green which means "go", one is yellow which means "go faster or else you'll have to wait for a while", and one red which means "stop, unless nobody is looking". The reason such seemingly superfluous icons are useful in GUI elements is the same reason the traffic lights don't just display the words "proceed", "prepare to stop", and "stop" in monochromatic lettering.
The other reason the they are useful is because GUI widgets like traffic lights are not always in the same location, position, orientation, or size. Having those same 3 colours consistently everywhere permits drivers from different places to know what those differently sized and positioned traffic lights means.
Just consider the little disk, stop sign, or check-marks icons that the user learns as "traffic lights" for the user interface. For common actions, the text is actually redundant and the icon becomes more important (to those not using screen readers anyway).
Having both is fine since some icons and themes are not very understandable or are even missing icons[1] and sometimes you do need to read the labels since not all actions are common[1] and need descriptions, and also for accessibility purposes. I don't see a problem with a toolkit-wide option to disable those icons if the user requests, but it seems presumptuous to assume that they are not useful or wanted by many people.
P.S. As you can tell this subject is extremely controversial outside of GNOME-land (or at least inside of Geany-land), please don't mistake rants for anything personal against your own valid opinions :)
Before GNOME 3.10 I was used the icons in the buttons and in the menus, but I see is realy ugly and not useful.
It's so subjective though, I happen to think the exact opposite. I use XFCE, Win7 and MacOS Lion too, so it's not like I'm just not used to the different takes on this. This is precisely what user preferences are good for.
Cheers, Matthew Brush
[1]: Although I think with stock icons at least there was a sane fallback built into GTK+, not sure if that's deprecated too.
Le 11/10/2013 02:14, Yosef Or Boczko a écrit :
On Fri, Oct 11, 2013 at 2:43 AM, Colomban Wendling lists.ban@herbesfolles.org wrote:
Le 11/10/2013 01:24, Yosef Or Boczko a écrit :
Hi all,
Hi. I won't be much available this WE so I'm dropping a quick reply.
I think is good idea to make the UI more clean and modern.
For this we need to port the images in the toolbar to symbol icons.
Why would it be more "clean" and "modern"? OK, GTK guys seem to think that having a non-uniform desktop experience by dropping one of the greatest features GTK had (stock items) is a good idea, so we probably will have to do something at some point, but I highly doubt it will make anything "cleaner".
BTW, IIUC (I didn't read all of all the threads) even them realize that breaking apps look with the same major toolkit version like they did for 3.10 wasn't a good idea.
The icons in Stock is icons in some sizes, not SVG. The symbolic icons is SVG, better polished. Note: also for the symbolic icons have a themes.
No, no and no. Stock icons *can* use SVG versions, in practice the image file choice behind is *exactly the same* with named icons or stock icons. Most themes provide pre-rendered 16, 24, 32, and 64 sizes, because it's faster, and because some size don't look that good just scaled down -- it's common to have a different, simpler, 16x16 icon. But in the end, stock or not, it follows the theme. It really does. I tell you. I double checked. Twice. And I even changed how our custom icons are registered so a theme could change them. And I tried doing so. And it worked. I tell you.
BTW, we *do* provide SVG version of our icons, see icons/scalable.
Also, in GNOME 3.10 the Stock items is drop [1], and UI with Stock is look outdated.
How does the UI look outdated? Using named icons won't change a thing, in the end they all use the theme's icons.
The icons in the menus and in the buttons in the dialogs isn't add any information. I not think the 'OK' icon is add information there isn't in the string „Save”.
It doesn't add information, it adds a visual help. Ask *anyone*, it's easier to recognize a picture than a word. Even if the picture isn't as explicit as the word is, once you know it it's a lot faster to recognize the icon than the word.
I attachad a patch and screenshot (with GTK+ 3.11.0, from git).
I missing some symbols: Choose a color, Build, Search & Replace, Compile, Save All, Reverte, Close All and Quit icons.
It's weird for Quit icon, and probably revert and search, but Build, Compiler, Save all, etc. are custom things so unless the theme provides some it will always look different, no matter what API you use. And the other items also use stock icons, and they use your theme.
About the custom icons: same to add a GEANY_STOCK_SAVE_ALL icon, I want to add a symbolic icon for Save All.
We do have one, just add your preferred geany-save-all icon to your theme and you're good to go. I'm sorry GTK doesn't provide a "save-all" icon we could use, heh, if there was a stock for that we'd use it ;)
<ot>(and BTW dropping stock items will most likely make weird icons more and more common)</ot>
For Stock Icons I missing many places, but I started to work on this (it just search and replace).
I don't like it, at least like you did it, because it drops a lot of icons (like in buttons). And I like icons on elements, it makes common things like Cancel or OK a lot easier to recognize at first glance.
As I sad: „The icons in the menus and in the buttons in the dialogs isn't add any information. I not think the 'OK' icon is add information there isn't in the string „Save”.”
As I said, "It doesn't add information, it adds a visual help. Ask *anyone*, it's easier to recognize a picture than a word."
I'm not saying that we should keep using stock items or something, but AFAIK there currently isn't much non-deprecated API that exists both in GTK2 and GTK3 that allows for icons (and even better, allows for icons at the user's choice -- I can't get why having or not icons can break a UI design, but I guess I'll never understand UI designer's POV apart that they love removing useful stuff because they think users a so duuuumb).
GTK+ 2.24.0 released in 2011, soon we are in 2014.
So?
Also the widgets with image in a menu is deprecated (GtkImageMenuItem, for example), and also the function to create a buttons with Stock item is deprecated (gtk_button_new_from_stock() and gtk_image_new_from_stock() for example).
Yeah I know and I really don't like this. BTW, IIRC even the GNOME HIG want icons for some menu items.
On Fri, 11 Oct 2013 02:14:59 +0200 Yosef Or Boczko yoseforb@gmail.com wrote:
The icons in Stock is icons in some sizes, not SVG.
GTK_ICON_SIZE_* do not specify any hardcoded pixel sizes. You can patch Geany with GTK_ICON_LOOKUP_FORCE_SVG, if you want.
The symbolic icons is SVG, better polished.
A common misconception. An SVG icon in today's 100-120 DPI displays may look better, or worse. Google for "TTF hinting", and consider that there is *no* hinting for SVG.
If the vector icons were always better, PNG-s in specific sizes would have been deleted long time ago.
Note: also for the symbolic icons have a themes.
The stock icons are entirely theme dependent.
As I sad: „The icons in the menus and in the buttons in the dialogs isn't add any information. I not think the 'OK' icon is add information there isn't in the string „Save”.”
You cite yourself as if your personal opinion is somehow more valuable than anyone else's opinion.
GTK+ 2.24.0 released in 2011, soon we are in 2014.
Debian stable + testing:
Packages dependent on GTK+ 2.24: 1930. Packages dependent on GTK+ 3.8: 676.
Also the widgets with image in a menu is deprecated (GtkImageMenuItem, for example), and also the function to create a buttons with Stock item is deprecated (gtk_button_new_from_stock() and gtk_image_new_from_stock() for example).
What's next, no menus and window titles because of the mobile devices? If Debian starts forcing this stupid crap, I'm switching to KDE.
Le 11/10/2013 19:08, Dimitar Zhekov a écrit :
[...]
If the vector icons were always better, PNG-s in specific sizes would have been deleted long time ago.
Maybe not, because actually rendering *all* desktop icons as SVG is really slow. Well, not *that* slow, but really noticeable on a nowadays machine, so even as simple cache PNGs would still be valid :)
I think adding support for vector icons is great, but removing the gtk stock icon feature, that's ridiculous, why don't they just update GTK to support any image format, rastor and vector both, as stock icons? Then it would be up to the theme to choose format.But I do strongly believe vector is better for the future because it's resolution independent, if GUIs relied 100% on variable formats/sizing like vector images and grid unit sizing, then it would be much easier to work with different form factors.Don't get me wrong, I know the performance fallbacks there would be with older machines, but it would be perfect for new technology.
Colomban Wendling lists.ban@herbesfolles.org wrote:
Le 11/10/2013 19:08, Dimitar Zhekov a écrit :
[...]
If the vector icons were always better, PNG-s in specific sizes would have been deleted long time ago.
Maybe not, because actually rendering *all* desktop icons as SVG is really slow. Well, not *that* slow, but really noticeable on a nowadays machine, so even as simple cache PNGs would still be valid :) _______________________________________________ Devel mailing list Devel@lists.geany.org https://lists.geany.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devel
Le 14/10/2013 21:24, Tory Gaurnier a écrit :
I think adding support for vector icons is great, but removing the gtk stock icon feature, that's ridiculous, why don't they just update GTK to support any image format
Well, ask them why they are dropping stock items, I only know of one single reason I find valid why they would have at least changed the API: inconsistency. GTK had APIs accepting both normal label strings and stock IDs, and the result changed whether the passed-in string matched a stock ID or not (like gtk_dialog_new_with_buttons() [1]). This probably isn't enough of a reason to drop the feature altogether, but it'd be one to fix the API.
[1] https://developer.gnome.org/gtk2/stable/GtkDialog.html#gtk-dialog-new-with-b...
rastor and vector both, as stock icons? Then it would be up to the theme to choose format. But I do strongly believe vector is better for the future because it's resolution independent, if GUIs relied 100% on variable formats/sizing like vector images and grid unit sizing, then it would be much easier to work with different form factors.Don't get me wrong, I know the performance fallbacks there would be with older machines, but it would be perfect for new technology.
As many of us already said, actually GTK *does* support SVG for icons since roughly forever, them being stock icons, named icons, or whatever icons.
Regards, Colomban
On 13-10-10 04:43 PM, Colomban Wendling wrote:
Le 11/10/2013 01:24, Yosef Or Boczko a écrit :
Hi all,
Hi. I won't be much available this WE so I'm dropping a quick reply.
I think is good idea to make the UI more clean and modern.
For this we need to port the images in the toolbar to symbol icons.
Why would it be more "clean" and "modern"? OK, GTK guys seem to think that having a non-uniform desktop experience by dropping one of the greatest features GTK had (stock items) is a good idea, so we probably
s/GTK guys/a GNOME designer/
What's more, it's not just "stock items" affected, if you look at the Git log, it's actually about 25-50 different incidental APIs that got deprecated by him without any prior public/open discussion or thoughtfulness on the amount of work, breakage and crappy code that it would introduce, or the fact that most GTK+[1] applications are not part of the GNOME project.
</gnome rant>
Cheers, Matthew Brush
[1]: GTK = GIMP Toolkit = GNU Image Manipulation Program Toolkit, *not* GNOME Toolkit as the GNOME design team seems to think :(
Regarding the rants like this one:
On 10/10/2013 05:43 PM, Colomban Wendling wrote:
I guess I'll never understand UI designer's POV apart that they love removing useful stuff because they think users a so duuuumb).
And this one:
On 10/10/2013 06:18 PM, Matthew Brush wrote:
What's more, it's not just "stock items" affected, if you look at the Git log, it's actually about 25-50 different incidental APIs that got deprecated by him without any prior public/open discussion or thoughtfulness on the amount of work, breakage and crappy code that it would introduce, or the fact that most GTK+[1] applications are not part of the GNOME project.
Anybody know what is wrong with the Gnome designers lately? Did they have a massive change in management or turnover in maintainers?
It seems strange to me they appear to be trying to piss off their main constituents in favor of tablet users.
So one guy is wreaking this havoc?
I'm just curious if any of you guys know the back story on this, because I'd be interested in knowing why I've had to go through all these pains lately.
Thanks,
Steve
On 13-10-10 04:24 PM, Yosef Or Boczko wrote:
Hi all,
I think is good idea to make the UI more clean and modern.
For this we need to port the images in the toolbar to symbol icons.
Also, in GNOME 3.10 the Stock items is drop [1],
SOOOOO stupid... as you can tell by my rants, and other peoples comments on that thread :)
and UI with Stock is look outdated.
How does it look outdated? It depends which icon theme you have. If you mean showing icons in menus and on buttons, which personally I very much like, there is (or was, if GNOME guys didn't drop it) a global preference to turn this on/off for yourself.
I attachad a patch and screenshot (with GTK+ 3.11.0, from git).
I don't see any difference in the screenshot, except different icons from the theme I use.
I missing some symbols: Choose a color, Build, Search & Replace, Compile, Save All, Reverte, Close All and Quit icons.
Custom icons, must get it into default/builtin GTK+ icon set (or Tango or however that works) if you want to drop them, or re-hard code them as XPMs in the source code like they used to be :) (actually I think "colour" icon is available in stock/tango/named/whatever icons).
For Stock Icons I missing many places, but I started to work on this (it just search and replace).
Meh. Even though we'll eventually be forced to follow stupid GNOME direction, we have until GTK+4 to start caring. I'd rather just disable deprecation warnings around the stock icon stuff until then, personally.
Cheers, Matthew Brush
On Fri, Oct 11, 2013 at 2:54 AM, Matthew Brush mbrush@codebrainz.ca wrote:
On 13-10-10 04:24 PM, Yosef Or Boczko wrote:
Hi all,
I think is good idea to make the UI more clean and modern.
For this we need to port the images in the toolbar to symbol icons.
Also, in GNOME 3.10 the Stock items is drop [1],
SOOOOO stupid... as you can tell by my rants, and other peoples comments on that thread :)
Thanks, I stupid :-)
and UI with Stock is look outdated.
How does it look outdated? It depends which icon theme you have. If you mean showing icons in menus and on buttons, which personally I very much like, there is (or was, if GNOME guys didn't drop it) a global preference to turn this on/off for yourself.
In GTK+ 2 was Stock item for icons in certain quality, and today, in 2013, have a SVG icons, is better. As I sad, also to the symbolic icons have a themes.
I attachad a patch and screenshot (with GTK+ 3.11.0, from git).
I don't see any difference in the screenshot, except different icons from the theme I use.
This not a different icons - it different a kind of icons.
I missing some symbols: Choose a color, Build, Search & Replace, Compile, Save All, Reverte, Close All and Quit icons.
Custom icons, must get it into default/builtin GTK+ icon set (or Tango or however that works) if you want to drop them, or re-hard code them as XPMs in the source code like they used to be :) (actually I think "colour" icon is available in stock/tango/named/whatever icons).
For Stock Icons I missing many places, but I started to work on this (it just search and replace).
Meh. Even though we'll eventually be forced to follow stupid GNOME direction, we have until GTK+4 to start caring. I'd rather just disable deprecation warnings around the stock icon stuff until then, personally.
Cheers, Matthew Brush
Devel mailing list Devel@lists.geany.org https://lists.geany.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/devel
On 13-10-10 05:19 PM, Yosef Or Boczko wrote:
On Fri, Oct 11, 2013 at 2:54 AM, Matthew Brush mbrush@codebrainz.ca wrote:
On 13-10-10 04:24 PM, Yosef Or Boczko wrote:
Hi all,
I think is good idea to make the UI more clean and modern.
For this we need to port the images in the toolbar to symbol icons.
Also, in GNOME 3.10 the Stock items is drop [1],
SOOOOO stupid... as you can tell by my rants, and other peoples comments on that thread :)
Thanks, I stupid :-)
and UI with Stock is look outdated.
How does it look outdated? It depends which icon theme you have. If you mean showing icons in menus and on buttons, which personally I very much like, there is (or was, if GNOME guys didn't drop it) a global preference to turn this on/off for yourself.
In GTK+ 2 was Stock item for icons in certain quality, and today, in 2013, have a SVG icons, is better. As I sad, also to the symbolic icons have a themes.
If I understand correctly, it should have been possible (if it's not already) to implement scalable SVG icons, which have a number of problems in practice (see below), without completely deprecating all APIs related to "stock items".
Regarding scalable/SVG icons, I don't think it's considered good practice to use them (at least in design community, AFAIK), because you can't take an icon designed at say 128px and then just display it at 16px without it looking terrible. You at least need several versions for the general sizes like small, medium and large, or whatever. See #3 on this page for a better description of what I mean:
http://psd.tutsplus.com/articles/7-principles-of-effective-icon-design/
Cheers, Matthew Brush
Le 11/10/2013 01:24, Yosef Or Boczko a écrit :
[...] and UI with Stock is look outdated.
I attachad a patch and screenshot (with GTK+ 3.11.0, from git).
I missing some symbols: Choose a color, Build, Search & Replace, Compile, Save All, Reverte, Close All and Quit icons.
BTW, how using named icons will solve this? :) It won't magically add icons to the theme, so you'll still have "ugly" icons for Build, Save All, or Close All ;)
